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Topic: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Replies: 103 Pages: 7 Last Post: Jul 25, 2005 8:43 PM by: jaime longoria

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Colin Rusch

Posts: 1,435
Registered: Oct 16, 2002

What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Jan 27, 2004 11:31 AM

The underlying question here is there some sort of coherent artistic voice among Minnesota based artists? Some will say yes, some no. Please explain why. The intention with this topic is to figure if there are better ways to present the Minnesota art community to people in other locations.

Sam Spiczka

Posts: 1,671
From: Sartell, MN
Registered: Jul 20, 2001

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Jan 28, 2004 8:29 PM

I posted this earlier but I think it applies here as well...

I'm skeptical that there is such a thing as a MN Art but to the extent that there is, I would suggest that it's unifying quality is its non-ideological nature. I don't mean that the artists here do not have core beliefs or withhold them from their work. But what I do mean is that the artists resist the impulse to subjugate their work to a narrow ideology. So, their work ends up being more diverse, independent, and hard to catagorize. The negative aspect of this can be a provincialness of narrow interest that appears eccentric or naive. The positives of this can be an independence, "trueness" and naivety that inspires. In one of the articles on this subject, the author mentions a movement out of Chicago in the 60s/70s that spread outwards and could serve as an inspiration for MN artists. A "movement" can make for great press and ease of identification, but it often makes for limited, conformist and jargon-filled work. I don't think a traditional "movement" would ever take root here. But I believe something far greater could.

Sam

Lauren DeSteno

Posts: 1,520
From: Minneapolis, MN
Registered: Oct 19, 2001

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 1, 2004 6:39 PM

As I stated before, I like Sam's take on this issue, but more questions have come to mind:

1. is it important to define yourself as a regional artist? (Minnesota artist, Minneapolis-based artist, etc.?)

2. Does a large group of minnesota-identified artists create power and agency for all minnesota artists?

3. Do you think that a group of MN identified artists will help create/define the goals of minnesota artists, increase or focus arts funding where it is wanted/needed, etc.?

Just putting this out there for discussion...

Lauren

Michael Fallon

Posts: 201
Registered: Jul 3, 2003

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 3, 2004 4:50 PM

edit

Ray Rolfe

Posts: 3,263
From: Northeast Minneapolis
Registered: Sep 5, 2001

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 3, 2004 7:42 PM

Rock on Bruce! When do you want to do that monkey pupet film?

Lauren DeSteno

Posts: 1,520
From: Minneapolis, MN
Registered: Oct 19, 2001

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 3, 2004 8:33 PM

That's interesting. Thank you for your thoughts, Michael.

I'd like to offer to everyone up some interesting (but potentially cynical and offensive) food for thought, that grew out of some recent reading, and was highlighted by a conversation I overheard last week. Some of my first thoughts concerning the topic of "Minnesota Artists" had me thinking back to the article "Baby, Please Don't Go" (by the famous Mr. Fallon himself). One statement in particular has lingered in the back of my mind ever since I read that article: "We have the paradoxical honor, it seems, of being a singularly robust export market."

And then, last week, I happened to overhear a coffeehouse conversation between two apparently middle-aged artists were having a conversation about the economy, the arts in Minnesota, and strategies for selling work. One artist had been selling in New York for a few years, the other had just gotten into a gallery. Both artists planned to leave Minnesota as soon as things came together - no questions asked.

At one point, Artist #1 says to Artist #2 (and I'm paraphrasing a bit, but you'll get the point), "Sure, Minnesota is a great place to live and make art - if you're a professor, have a spouse that will support you, or make art mediocre enough for Minnesotans to buy."

The second said, "Yes, and if you don't get out by 40 you're dead in the water."

Wow. I was stunned. Could they be right, or are they just jaded? Or, does every Minnesota artist secretly use MN as a training ground for bigger (and presumably better) things? Could it be possible that the one thing that unites us all is a desperate drive to get the hell out of here?

And if so, how can we hope to form a community with one foot out the door?

(Like I said, potentially offensive. I don't mean this in a condescending way, nor do I mean to suggest that all MN artists hate it here. Please don't string me up by my thumbs!)

Lauren

Gabriel Combs

Posts: 1,497
Registered: Jun 16, 2002

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 3, 2004 9:37 PM

Well, some range of thought. I won't leave MN for artistic career interests. Quote me on that.

Michael, I invite you to write bad criticsm on me. heh. Good point about pr. Its needed, its business to do art for money. I say, accept it. At heart, I don't care if I ever "make" it. I will continue on regardless. I will pump my shit though.

"You know my style, you know my name..." -Krs1

Yeah, weather, isolation, solitude to work. The proper addition of community will grow it. Success will be here for a lot of artists. This bruce guy outranted us. damn.

Gabriel Combs

Posts: 1,497
Registered: Jun 16, 2002

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 3, 2004 9:50 PM

btw: I will be happy to take Bruce's spot at the next meeting.

gabrielmcombs@hotmail.com

612-872-8366

Sam Spiczka

Posts: 1,671
From: Sartell, MN
Registered: Jul 20, 2001

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 3, 2004 10:21 PM

> Wow. I was stunned. Could they be right, or are they
> just jaded? Or, does every Minnesota artist secretly
> use MN as a training ground for bigger (and
> presumably better) things? Could it be possible that
> the one thing that unites us all is a desperate drive
> to get the hell out of here?

I always thought it was the hatred of winter that united us. I desperately want to leave this place... but only from around November to April. Then I'll come back and be lovin' it. I can't work outside when the weather is like this so it limits my aesthetic choices. But I don't foresee the ability to afford two residences anytime soon so decisions will have to be made.

I think these points have to be brought out into the open, Lauren. They are a part of our reality. I don't know about career enhancement opportunities elsewhere but I am concerned about sales. I believe it has been noted that there is not a real base for $1000 plus priced artworks here, much less $10k plus. But maybe there is the opportunity to grow the market, to convince local collectors through sheer quality of work to spend their money here instead of exporting it out East.

But this will not be easy. And it will take a lot of P.R. I was reading some on the economics of prestige and the psychological impulse to pay more for something that is the same or even inferior so long as it is perceived as having exclusivity. In a high end grocery store, you may pay four times as much for the exact same product. Why pay more? Because you can and it makes you feel superior. To me, MN is like a reasonably priced grocery store with a really good selection. You can find just about anything, it will be satisfying and won't break the bank. But many shoppers in this store do what I do, they try to shave pennies, use coupons, and wait for specials to get a good deal. The high end art shopper does not behave this way. They are glad to pay more. They love paying more not because of what they are getting, but because of what they believe it says about them. A high end collector will gladly pay $100k for a painting at a prestigious NY gallery that is identical in quality to a $5k one elsewhere. But this collector would not even consider buying the $5k painting. Unreasonable you say? Now you're thinking like a Minnesotan!

When a small group can make it prestigious to support the local arts, then we will see change. I think some alchemy of great art, great expectations and great advertising could get the job done (though sadly, these elements are probably listed in reverse order of importance).

Sam

Sam Spiczka

Posts: 1,671
From: Sartell, MN
Registered: Jul 20, 2001

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 3, 2004 10:23 PM

And Lauren, you really shouldn't be eaves-dropping...

Sam

Brian Capanoli

Posts: 42
Registered: Nov 10, 2003

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 3, 2004 11:38 PM

Hmmm... what constitutes a Minnesota artist? I think it's the voice that we convey. We express art for its own sake, in a balanced voice, and not like the edgy types in the Eastern Seaboard, nor the airy types on the West Coast. We can be practical about our arts, and not be cynical or cold like one might find out East, but we also won't find ourselves quite as mushy as those on the West coast. We aren't fakey or phoney in the way we express ourselves, trying to appease the audience, but sincere in our expressions of art. We are not a media capital or media state like possibly New York or California might be, and that's what allows us to practice our arts, feeling that it expresses itself, instead of having to rely upon mass media to embellish what we're trying to express. This is what art is supposed to be about, not only in Minnesota, but anywhere else.

Lauren DeSteno

Posts: 1,520
From: Minneapolis, MN
Registered: Oct 19, 2001

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 4, 2004 12:13 AM

> A high end collector will gladly pay
> $100k for a painting at a prestigious NY gallery that
> is identical in quality to a $5k one elsewhere.

I don't profess to know much about the psychology of art collecting (much less at any price over $65, which is the most I've been able to afford), but your point that this psychological value system is what drives MN folks out East - or at least to seek gallery representation on the coast(s).

Maybe we're more savvy than we give ourselves credit - some folks are able to buy low (live in MN) and sell high (export art to NYC).

So really, if our art export economy is strong, if you buy art in NYC, you might be supporting a clandestine Minnesota artist!

> But
> this collector would not even consider buying the $5k
> painting. Unreasonable you say? Now you're thinking
> like a Minnesotan!

True. I'm from the east coast, so I have spent a good deal of time there (and visit fairly regularly), and one thing that always gets me is the insane prices for name-brand clothing/accessories. And it's not like some trendy fashion fever either - it's just expected that if you have a decent job (and I'm not talking mega bucks here - I'm talking boring, college-educated middle-class America salary) you will pay $$$ for a Louis Vuitton or Prada purse. (Or are they called handbags? The world may never know.)

Folks with similar jobs here (and a good dose of Minnesota practicality) would purchase plain, understated, functional yet sophisticated items. At a discount store. On clearance. With a coupon.

Maybe we should have an art coupon day. Anyway, I digress.

lauren

Bob Schulz

Posts: 416
From: Brooklyn Park, MN
Registered: Aug 15, 2003

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 4, 2004 8:06 PM

Real communities are spontaneous not planned.

Gabriel Combs

Posts: 1,497
Registered: Jun 16, 2002

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 4, 2004 8:11 PM

mmm... silicon...

Bob Schulz

Posts: 416
From: Brooklyn Park, MN
Registered: Aug 15, 2003

Re: What Constitues a Minnesota Artist?
Posted: Feb 4, 2004 8:32 PM

Let's pretend.

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